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sweetolbob
09-06-2018, 11:13 AM
Decided to upgrade the 2X40 watt 4-foot florescent shop lights in my pole barn to LED. I found a set of 10 42 watt 5000K 4-foot lights on Amazon for $249.95 ($25/ea) delivered so I ordered them. BBounder brand name. They showed up last night so I started to hang them in the polebarn today.

Holy smoke! What a difference!!

The first picture is a shot of one LED installed and the two florescents behind it. Second shot is with all three LED's in place. And the last is a shot of the delivered package. UPS needs to upgrade it's efforts if this all the damage they can do to a 35# package. They have almost demolished much smaller ones.

- I know it's not in Stove Hugger's as I chose here for more forum eyeballs. There is a really pretty Daytona Yellow Avanti in the shot, however.
- I ain't cleaning up for no darn pictures, still to deep in getting the 74 road ready.
- One of the reasons for the change is cold weather starting. We'll see down the road about ability to start in under freezing conditions and longevity, but for now I'm happy.
- When I looked at the delivery confirmation, These were shipped from California to Michigan by UPS Next Day Air to meet the 2-day window. WOW!.

75441 75442 75443

Bob

BobWaitz
09-06-2018, 11:33 AM
I replaced the old fluorescent unit in the corner of the basement with a new LED one and can't believe the difference. New ones have gone in over my workbenches in the basement and the garage. As I run out of tubes for the remaining fixtures, I will replace them with the LED units.

When you are auditioning LED fixtures for the shop consider whether it has a diffuser and where it hangs relative to eye level. In the basement the first one I got did not have a diffuser but because the ceiling is only 7 feet, it was a little rough on the eyes. I moved that out to the garage where it hangs much higher and there is no problem.

Commander Eddie
09-06-2018, 11:35 AM
Bob,
I too switched my shop over to LED and I love them. They come right on and are plenty bright. They were so nice and bright that I quickly realized how dirty the shop was. I recommend LED to everyone.

swvalcon
09-06-2018, 11:50 AM
Put in some LED's in the shop about 6 months ago. So far only 6 but plan another 6 later. Use to have use a flash light to see now I need sunglasses.

Colgate Studebaker
09-06-2018, 01:59 PM
My son replaced the fluorescent tubes in his fixtures with LED's and likes the results. Are you guys replacing the entire fixture or just the bulbs? I have the fluorescents in my shop but they are relatively new (5 years) and I don't want to replace them till they start acting up. By then I imagine the tubes will only be needing replacement, who knows as technology advances. Bill

wittsend
09-06-2018, 02:09 PM
My Mother in Law recently bought a house with LED's in the garage. WOW! The bulbs cost $765,000..., but the house came with them. LOL Plus, most LED's (the shop type) are color balanced to daylight which can be helpful. As someone who had a career in TV production the added light and balance to daylight is a plus for those who You Tube their projects.

sweetolbob
09-06-2018, 02:25 PM
My son replaced the fluorescent tubes in his fixtures with LED's and likes the results. Are you guys replacing the entire fixture or just the bulbs? I have the fluorescents in my shop but they are relatively new (5 years) and I don't want to replace them till they start acting up. By then I imagine the tubes will only be needing replacement, who knows as technology advances. Bill

Bill

The lights I bought look like two tubes but are actually a one-piece unit that doesn't allow for replacement bulbs. I went this way after buying a couple of replacement bulbs that were "guaranteed" to replace the bulbs in my existing florescent fixtures. They did not work so I would have had to pull the fixtures apart, bypass/remove the ballast and reroute the wires to the contacts on the end. The bulbs were about $10 each so I decided to just replace the whole thing for the $25/ea.

I'd suggest you buy a couple of LED bulbs for yours and see if they work. If not, then you'll have the data you need to make a decision.

The one's I bought are "daylight" level light and I sure am glad I did after final polishing out a couple of Avanti panels today, you can see the quality and shine just like you were outside. They are bright but high enough in the air so they don't glare and they have a pull chain to shut off individually if necessary.

Bob

53k
09-06-2018, 02:49 PM
I bought four 40 watt 4-foot long LED units almost four years ago. I hung two in my 12'x24' garage and two provided PLENTY of light. Mine hang about eight feet above the floor and with the diffusers, there is bright even light throughout the building. I bought mine at the local Home Depot. The garage is unheated and uncooled with no insulation. The lights don't know the difference or even care. The ones I bought came with four-foot cables that will allow hooking up a string of nine (as I remember) using only the original outlet. I'll be hanging the remaining two in my 24'x36' steel building at about 12 feet from the floor.
In my attached two-car garage (23'x20' with 11' ceilings) the house had two 500-watt incandescent light bulbs in the ceiling close to the house end. They were way bright if you looked directly at them, but they get very hot and the light doesn't spread well. I was going to rewire to be able to string several 40-watt 4-foot LED units but didn't get around to it. I found a two-pack of 40-watt screw-in LED shop lights on Amazon. They cast an amazing amount of even (cool) light. I'm not tempted to change anything. To see them on Amazon, click https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B076Q5NB6R

For Colgate Studebaker- I don't believe they make LED tubes to replace 40-watt four-foot florescent tubes since they work much differently than florescent.

Gunslinger
09-06-2018, 03:11 PM
I've replaced nearly all the lights in my house with LEDs wherever possible...big difference. In my tool room I replaced the fluorescents with new fixtures and LED tubes available at Costco. Again...huge difference. The old fixtures I sold on Craigslist.

RadioRoy
09-06-2018, 03:18 PM
For Colgate Studebaker- I don't believe they make LED tubes to replace 40-watt four-foot florescent tubes since they work much differently than florescent.

Well... yes they do.

I have two of them illuminating my attic train layout. The fixtures are hardwired in (I had no idea at the time that fluorescent technology would change so quickly and so many times). So I just bought these LED replacement tubes at Home Depot and stuck them in the fixtures, without modifying the fixtures at all.

gordr
09-06-2018, 03:32 PM
The 4-foot 40-watt LED tubes are intended to be used without a ballast. so you simply wire them in directly to 120 volts AC. But they draw so little juice, that they may work fine running through the ballast. It's usually very easy to remove the ballasts and rewire, and you are getting rid of a component that might short and cause a fire.

bumpkinvilledano
09-06-2018, 06:01 PM
They are also a good fit in an enclosed car/cargo trailer. A small 750 watt inverter will easily power a couple. I used 2 that I picked up at Big Orange for around $40 each and like mentioned above, I almost need sunglasses.

rockne10
09-06-2018, 07:56 PM
Direct replacement LED tubes that can be installed in fluorescent fixtures without disconnecting the ballast run about $20/tube. Then, if your ballast should happen to falter, you are also stuck with useless LED tubes.
Disconnecting the ballast and doing a minor rewire of the fixture tombstone allows you to use LED tubes with standard pins in any existing florescent fixture.

RadioRoy
09-06-2018, 10:01 PM
Gord and Brad,
I understand about the ballast, but the fixture is hardwired to the ceiling and directly over the trains. I contemplated removing the whole fixture and installing an outlet, or just removing the fixture cover and removing the ballast. But the fact that it is hard to reach, and directly over the trains, has moved the project back until it comes to the top of the urgent list.

52 Ragtop
09-06-2018, 10:34 PM
I re lamped my whole house with all LED, made a huge difference in brightness, and my electric bill went way down too! Still have the 8' fluorescent bulbs in the shop, would love to find 8' led ones!

Jim

bensherb
09-06-2018, 11:01 PM
I've had all LED's in my house for some time and they seem to last longer than the compact florescent's did plus better light with less power. I've got a stack of 23, 4ft dual lamp LED units to go into my shop when I get a chance. I did swap one of the florescent tubes over my tool boxes and one over my bench for LED's a couple years ago and they're great!

Hey Bob, how do you work in such a clean shop? Compared to mine it's spotless. :lol: I figure I either have time to work, or time to clean; I prefer to work so I've become use to the "single track" trails to get to stuff. :D Beside; a messy shop is a sign of a creative mind! At least that's what I heard, and I'm goin' with it!

garyash
09-06-2018, 11:57 PM
The LED tubes to replace older T32 or T40 fluorescent tubes will work on newer electronic ballasts but not on older magnetic ballasts - the old ballasts will quickly burn out. Been there, done that. How do you tell which kind of ballasts you have? Take a photo on your smart phone of the fluorescent tubes lit up. If you see stripes in the photo, the ballast is a magnetic type. Note that you may need to turn the phone to be parallel or perpendicular to the tubes to see this well. If you have magnetic ballasts, you can replace them at relatively low cost, easier and cheaper than an entire new fixture in most cases.
75488

Warren Webb
09-07-2018, 12:42 AM
I've been replacing the lights here in the new house with LED's. In tne master bedroom 4 bulbs were rated at 45 watts each (not the usage which is about 8 watts) but were so bright I put a dimmer switch in that took care of that. Yes, they were dimmable bulbs.

In the garage I had bought some LED fixtures that work great. However, I bought 2 boxes of LED bulbs at Costco that were supposed to be direct fit. One pair work good but the other pair I am taking back. That fixture works fine with the florissant bulbs but not with this pair of LED's.

I replaced the front porch lamp with an LED fixture & noticed last winter that when it got below freezing it wouldn't work.

TWChamp
09-07-2018, 04:24 AM
That's strange, because all my LED bulbs work fine no matter how cold it gets.

Colgate Studebaker
09-07-2018, 05:40 AM
Thanks for the experiences guys, I'm not ready to change just yet but I wanted to know what works best. When we built (moved in 5 years ago this weekend) we put in LED's in the house but my shop wasn't wired at that time (did that about 6 months later) and I wasn't too hot on shop LED fixtures at that time. Hence the fluorescents which I hard wired in so any type of LED's I switch to will have to be conversion or direct replacement. Thanks, Bill.

sweetolbob
09-07-2018, 10:07 AM
Hey Bob, how do you work in such a clean shop? Compared to mine it's spotless. :lol: I figure I either have time to work, or time to clean; I prefer to work so I've become use to the "single track" trails to get to stuff. :D Beside; a messy shop is a sign of a creative mind! At least that's what I heard, and I'm goin' with it!

^^^^^^^^!!!!! Well said. :cool:

Bob

DEEPNHOCK
09-07-2018, 04:20 PM
Oh.....Great....:p
You should see the video of me walking around the shop twisting my smart(er than me)phone under every CASO auction purchased fluorescent light fixture... (Yes, it is true:rolleyes:)
Note: Some are yellow...some are green... Follow the yellow brick road:!:... Also, it takes some time for the stripes to show up.
Some are sharp, some are foggy faint.....
And.. I have changed several ballasts over the years and the new(er) ballasts don't barber shop....
Now, because of your post... I have to make a schematic of the shop to note which lights can be done with which ballasts.
(There are 20 single lights and 21 double lights).... I think I'll buy a few of each and only change them over when they fail...
Sigh.....:rolleyes:




The LED tubes to replace older T32 or T40 fluorescent tubes will work on newer electronic ballasts but not on older magnetic ballasts - the old ballasts will quickly burn out. Been there, done that. How do you tell which kind of ballasts you have? Take a photo on your smart phone of the fluorescent tubes lit up. If you see stripes in the photo, the ballast is a magnetic type. Note that you may need to turn the phone to be parallel or perpendicular to the tubes to see this well. If you have magnetic ballasts, you can replace them at relatively low cost, easier and cheaper than an entire new fixture in most cases.
75488

willys54
09-08-2018, 10:09 AM
I'm an incandescent guy stuck in an LED world...........:eek:

TWChamp
09-08-2018, 10:35 AM
I'm an incandescent guy stuck in an LED world...........:eek:

Time to make the switch and use all the money you save to buy more Studebakers.

studegary
09-08-2018, 11:22 AM
Time to make the switch and use all the money you save to buy more Studebakers.

I know that they use less electricity, but at the cost of the bulbs, I do not figure that they would ever pay for themselves (in my lifetime or the lifetime of the bulbs). I have been sticking with three for a dollar incandescents and dollar florescents.

DEEPNHOCK
09-08-2018, 11:40 AM
Your reply reminds me of a Joe Walsh (Jeff Lynne produced) song... "Analog Man"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=il1Byvn_vMA


I'm an incandescent guy stuck in an LED world...........:eek:

bensherb
09-08-2018, 12:21 PM
I know that they use less electricity, but at the cost of the bulbs, I do not figure that they would ever pay for themselves (in my lifetime or the lifetime of the bulbs). I have been sticking with three for a dollar incandescents and dollar florescents.

The standard "bulb" type LED's I have in every lamp in the house cost a buck or less, including the flood lights in the back yard, and the 4 ft twin LED fixtures cost the same $20 with the tubes that the florescents I'm replacing did 22 years ago. Just to replace the florescsnt tubes now costs half that. Given the value of a dollar now it's all WAY cheaper now.

I remember paying $7 a piece for compact florescents when changing from incandescents. "But, it's ok they'll last 7 years", yeah right, if they lasted a year you were doing good. It's been over 3 years now and I have not had a $1 LED bulb fail yet.

The power useage of LED's is 1/8th to 1/10th that of incandescents and less than half of a florescent. If you use any lights at all, cost will be recouped very quickly.

Heck, in my GT I measured the current draw of every incandescent lamp in it, shy the headlamps; if you could run every light simaltaniously the current draw would be about 22 amps. After swapping all those bulbs to LED's the total draw would now be just over 2 amps. The led bulbs were no more expensive than replacement incandescent bulbs and many were far cheaper.

DEEPNHOCK
09-08-2018, 01:15 PM
Lumens...
With all the LED hoopla, I look at lumens..
Bought several LED bulbs with a fairly high lumen number, and have put them in my retractable shop light.
Here's what I have experienced:
(A) They are tougher than the 'rough service' bulbs. (I drop things a lot :rolleyes:)
(B) They last longer (also because I drop things a lot :whome:).
(C) They save no electricity (based on how hot the bulb transformer part gets :p...and my power bill)
(D) When they are as cheap as regular fluorescent bulbs... Will revisit...)

48skyliner
09-08-2018, 02:08 PM
Several years ago I bought all new 8 foot dual bulb fluorescent fixtures for my shop, all with the high power (90 or 110 watt)bulbs. The light was great, but I soon learned that they are extra bright when new, then lose some brightness. The problem is that unless you spend a lot of money to get fixtures with real transformer ballasts, you get electronic ballasts, which are just crap, and fail after a few years.

About a year ago I started replacing the ones that fail with the 4 foot FEIT LED fixtures from Costco, which are much brighter and cost $20 each on sale. Replacing these is easier than you might think - they are "linkable", each having a standard 6 foot 115 volt cord on one end, and an outlet on the other end, so you can plug into any standard outlet, then plug more into a string. I also got the screw-in adapters and plugged these LED lights into my garage door openers, the lights that come on when you open or close the door.

The walls in my shop are all covered with sheet rock, and painted bright white. I always use the semi-gloss because it is easy to clean. I also had the ceiling ( a metal building) sprayed with about 2 inches of urethane foam and then I sprayed that bright white. In case you don't know, the reflectivity of even slightly "off white" or cream color is drastically less than bright white.

RadioRoy
09-08-2018, 03:32 PM
I'm an incandescent guy stuck in an LED world...........:eek:

I tell folks that I am an American League (Minnesota Twins and Oakland A's) guy stuck in a National League (SF Giants) town.

48skyliner
09-08-2018, 03:47 PM
Can't help thinking about that great line from George Gobel - "Did you ever feel like the world is a tuxedo and you are a pair of brown shoes?"

studegary
09-08-2018, 07:02 PM
The standard "bulb" type LED's I have in every lamp in the house cost a buck or less, including the flood lights in the back yard, and the 4 ft twin LED fixtures cost the same $20 with the tubes that the florescents I'm replacing did 22 years ago. Just to replace the florescsnt tubes now costs half that. Given the value of a dollar now it's all WAY cheaper now.

I remember paying $7 a piece for compact florescents when changing from incandescents. "But, it's ok they'll last 7 years", yeah right, if they lasted a year you were doing good. It's been over 3 years now and I have not had a $1 LED bulb fail yet.

The power useage of LED's is 1/8th to 1/10th that of incandescents and less than half of a florescent. If you use any lights at all, cost will be recouped very quickly.

Heck, in my GT I measured the current draw of every incandescent lamp in it, shy the headlamps; if you could run every light simaltaniously the current draw would be about 22 amps. After swapping all those bulbs to LED's the total draw would now be just over 2 amps. The led bulbs were no more expensive than replacement incandescent bulbs and many were far cheaper.

Thank you for this information. It looks like I should revisit this (LEDs). Locally, I have only noticed inexpensive LEDs that are equivalent to 40W or 60W bulbs, not 75W or 100W. I buy incandescent bulbs for three or four per dollar.
There is a big variation in the life of $1 CFLs. I put them in lights on the front and back porches. The one in the back lasted only weeks. The one in the front has been there so many years that I do not remember the last time that I changed it. There is another next to me now that has been used every evening for many years. (Now, they will probably both fail.) Over a bath sink, with multiple lights, I use CFLs and one incandescent (for more rapid start).
I am also not a fan of the light color from LEDs.

sweetolbob
09-08-2018, 09:16 PM
I know that they use less electricity, but at the cost of the bulbs, I do not figure that they would ever pay for themselves (in my lifetime or the lifetime of the bulbs). I have been sticking with three for a dollar incandescents and dollar florescents.

Check my math 'cause I'm old and - well I forget what else - But

A 100 watt incandescent = 23 watt Florescent = 14 watt LED.

I run almost totally LED's and the rest will become LED's when they burn out. I have several lights in the house that burn up to 6 hrs a day and they are 100 watts and LED's. The multi - light fixtures run 60 watts including the bath rooms and bedrooms.

I pay anywhere from $1 for 60 watts to about $8 for a 100 watt equivalent. If I calculate the cost of running 100 watt incandescent six hours a day for an entire year, and I have two that do that, it's $24/yr at my electric cost $0.11/kw-hr. An LED would cost less than $3.50 annually. Multiply that by two in my house.

I won't have an incandescent in my house if you gave them to me. I also have high ceilings an some of the bulbs are a bit-- to get to. LED's last a long time and in the multi-fixture units don't generate as much heat.

Don't get me started on florescents in cold weather and dependability. Flourescents are a lot more efficient than incandescents but they still cost about 2X LED's to run so in my book it's an easy and economical decision.

BTW - The last time I sold an old refrigerator to the local energy company for an energy credit of $50, they picked it up and handed me a box of 10 60 watt LED's for helping them save energy.

I'm saving the planet one refrigerator and LED bulb at a time. ;)

Bob

bensherb
09-08-2018, 10:42 PM
Thank you for this information. It looks like I should revisit this (LEDs). Locally, I have only noticed inexpensive LEDs that are equivalent to 40W or 60W bulbs, not 75W or 100W. I buy incandescent bulbs for three or four per dollar.

I am also not a fan of the light color from LEDs.

Around here a standard incandescent bulb is hard to find, but when you see them they're asking around 4 bucks for them. I would never buy a 75 or 100 watt equivilent standard fixture type LED bulb they're way too bright, I do have some 100watt floods though, $1 at the dollar store. In fact, I look for 40 watt equiv. LED bulbs; even the 60's are too bright for in the house.

As for color, I agree, but you need to stay away from the 6000 kelvin and higher bulbs, very bright white. What you want is 3000-4000 Kelvin they're like "warm white" florescents, more like an incandescent. The one in my hand is 40w, uses 7w, 3000k, 600 lumen. The 40's tend to run 400-600 lumen and 4 to 7 watt usage, but they're a buck all day long around here. ( the wal-mart ones buzzed though)

TWChamp
09-09-2018, 01:40 AM
I bought several CFL bulbs to replace incandescent bulbs about 10 years ago. Two of them went up in smoke, so I won't use them anymore. I have a meter that records amps used to power anything plugged into it, as well as power used during a weeks usage. Turns out my old refrigerator is doing fine, and my 40 watt equivalent LED bulbs use so little power that they don't register on the meter.


I keep a few incandescent bulbs to heat bearings, so they will slide onto a shaft easier if they are a press fit.