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rbigcal
12-06-2017, 02:17 PM
I was exploring the possibility of having a pair of license plate frames 3d printed. Anybody out here in studebaker land have the capability of creating a 3d file from a photo ?

Ron Dame
12-06-2017, 04:30 PM
I'm watching, I'd like to have my pot metal ones reproduced for everyday use

DougHolverson
12-06-2017, 04:36 PM
Look into a local Maker group. They may have a Kinect or even a regular 3D scanner set up to do that.

JRoberts
12-06-2017, 04:59 PM
When you say "license plate frames" are you speaking of the frames that surround the plate, possibly with advertising or the like on the frame? If so when making them some states, including North Carolina have a law that technically bans those. I think they don't enforce it unless it covers any of the printed material on the plate.

Ron Dame
12-06-2017, 05:05 PM
Look into a local Maker group. They may have a Kinect or even a regular 3D scanner set up to do that.
What about chroming? or "chroming"? Or whatever can make it shiney and silvery?

Ron Dame
12-06-2017, 05:07 PM
When you say "license plate frames" are you speaking of the frames that surround the plate, possibly with advertising or the like on the frame? If so when making them some states, including North Carolina have a law that technically bans those. I think they don't enforce it unless it covers any of the printed material on the plate.
It seems to be not enforced here, unless you are pulled for something else and they need a reason. We still have plates with the clear covers over them too, and they are illegal as well.

rbigcal
12-06-2017, 05:32 PM
What about chroming? or "chroming"? Or whatever can make it shiney and silvery?

I don't know of any law here in Nazifornia that has anything to do with the frames. Plastic can be chromed and there are places that do 3d printing with metal. Lot of places to do the printing, but first you have to make a STL file of the object to be printed. I think that is the expensive part. I thought maybe a stude person on here might know how to do it at a lower cost. I have been kicking around the idea to try and sand cast one, but I would need the proper blank or take one with lettering on it and remove the lettering then glue the proper lettering on the blank to use for a pattern. Kind of a pita, but I am hell bent on having the dealer frames on my Wagonaire from the dealer that sold it !

StudeRich
12-06-2017, 05:54 PM
If I were going to make one, I would make it Generic like the really COOL actual Stude. Dealer Name on Figueroa at 48th. St. in Los Angeles that my Dad's New '64 Daytona came from:
"Village Studebaker". :cool:

That way, you could defray the cost by selling them to EVERYONE! :)

I think this WAS probably it. :(
https://www.google.com/maps/@33.999228,-118.2824769,3a,75y,359.94h,92.04t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sVjFYHis5PmxVleuV6XZa4g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

rbigcal
12-06-2017, 06:01 PM
69026 This is what I want to make, I have had wanted ads on the internet for about a year now. No leads so far

Skip Lackie
12-06-2017, 06:47 PM
For the record, in the US it is against the law in every state to cover the state name or any part of the license number with a frame or anything else that would interfere with it being read. However, states cannot prohibit covering over any slogan or other material (ie, "Garden State") that the state chooses to put on its license plates. That was the decision of the US Supreme Court in the late 1960s, after a person covered over the legend "World's Fair" on his 1964-65 New York license plates. The court ruled that the purpose of a license plate is vehicle identification, and both the state name and tag number were essential to fulfill that function. But vehicle owners could not be obligated to carry advertising for their state or industry.

The problem is that some states put their name on the top of the plate, and some on the bottom. So a single "universal" plate frame would have to have thin margins on both the top and bottom -- leaving not a lot of room for readable text.

sweetolbob
12-06-2017, 06:52 PM
69026 This is what I want to make, I have had wanted ads on the internet for about a year now. No leads so far

Try O,Brien Truckers, they cast old club plaques. You may need a minimum order.

http://www.obrientruckers.com/

Bob

jclary
12-06-2017, 06:57 PM
I don't know if we've discussed this before, but 3D printers are like anything else that manufacturers an actual product. They are "size dependent." Meaning, they might be able to print something as simple as a coffee mug, or a set of pistol grips, but unless it has a fairly large print bed, it might not be capable of printing the rather flat overall dimension of a license plate.

For example, my "go to" computer guy sells used 3D printers. From him, you can get into the 3D printer game for under $500 bucks. In his shop, he has a whole wall with a table loaded with various 3D printers. Different capabilities, sizes, and of course, prices. Several times, I have threatened to buy one. But, I know if I ever do, I'll probably never get any of my other projects completed. From what I recall, most of these desk top printers make objects and components within a 5" cube space. Much larger than that, and the price elevates rapidly. Otherwise, I believe larger objects would have to be printed in smaller component/segment pieces and assembled for their completed size.

My computer sales friend, for his charity mission work, prints artificial hands, in segments, and assembles them to donate to war victims in Africa. If you have a machine with the appropriate physical print area, a license plate frame should be rather simple once the program is written.

Jerry Forrester
12-06-2017, 07:37 PM
I don't know if we've discussed this before, but 3D printers are like anything else that manufacturers an actual product. They are "size dependent." Meaning, they might be able to print something as simple as a coffee mug, or a set of pistol grips, but unless it has a fairly large print bed, it might not be capable of printing the rather flat overall dimension of a license plate.

For example, my "go to" computer guy sells used 3D printers. From him, you can get into the 3D printer game for under $500 bucks. In his shop, he has a whole wall with a table loaded with various 3D printers. Different capabilities, sizes, and of course, prices. Several times, I have threatened to buy one. But, I know if I ever do, I'll probably never get any of my other projects completed. From what I recall, most of these desk top printers make objects and components within a 5" cube space. Much larger than that, and the price elevates rapidly. Otherwise, I believe larger objects would have to be printed in smaller component/segment pieces and assembled for their completed size.

My computer sales friend, for his charity mission work, prints artificial hands, in segments, and assembles them to donate to war victims in Africa. If you have a machine with the appropriate physical print area, a license plate frame should be rather simple once the program is written.

My daughter's 3D printer will print an object about 10" long and 10" wide, I don't know how high, maybe 10 inches.. She could print a license plate frame but it would have to be in two pieces. I'll ask her about making a file from a picture.

garyash
12-06-2017, 10:43 PM
You can have one 3D printed in white nylon for about $65 each, black nylon for $66, plus tax and shipping. Size is about 12-1/8 x 6-3/4 x 1/4. Don't even ask what it would cost in metal! You can spray it with any color paint you want. The lettering is raised about 0.040". It's not exactly the same font, but closest available to me. Close enough copy for you?

I lived and worked in Santa Rosa in the 1970s, remember the Torvick dealership, but they weren't a Studebaker dealer then.

69027

rbigcal
12-06-2017, 11:17 PM
You can have one 3D printed in white nylon for about $65 each, black nylon for $66, plus tax and shipping. Size is about 12-1/8 x 6-3/4 x 1/4. Don't even ask what it would cost in metal! You can spray it with any color paint you want. The lettering is raised about 0.040". It's not exactly the same font, but closest available to me. Close enough copy for you?

I lived and worked in Santa Rosa in the 1970s, remember the Torvick dealership, but they weren't a Studebaker dealer then.

69027

Is that picture exactly as it would be printed ? Is that the 3d file ?

garyash
12-07-2017, 09:44 AM
Yes, that's the 3D file. When printed in white nylon, it will be all white. Printed in black nylon, it's all black. Drawing it in CAD, I told the software that the part was made of steel (gray), just so I wasn't looking at a white art on a white background on the screen. I scaled things from the mounting hole locations which should be 7.0" left-to-right and 4.75" top-to-bottom. It's designed for a standard 12" x 6" plate. What are the actual outside dimensions of your frame?

The CAD model is flat on the back, though the original frame probably has a recess for the plate. I can hollow out the back a bit, but need to keep enough meat so the frame doesn't get fragile. Have you got a photo of the back? Or, did you only have an Ebay photo? What's the exact size of the plate you want to put in it? My recollection of these frames is that there was just enough wiggle room on the back side to line up the mounting holes in the frame and plate and just enough depth that the frame would still push the plate against the mounting surface.

The as-printed material is just slightly rough. You can sand it a little to smooth it out. It's also porous, so it should be primed and painted all over. You can use any kind of paint. There are some chrome-like paints now in spray cans that would look OK. Then paint the tops of the letters any color you want.

Go to Shapeways.com and read about the White, Strong, and Flexible material. It's the least expensive 3D material from them, but it is strong and will hold up well outdoors.

6902869029

rbigcal
12-07-2017, 01:21 PM
Amazing work you did there Gary! You are right backside is recessed. And yes the picture I found on the internet from an old auction. I do have an old frame that is a very similar style that could be used for dimensions. Looks like its a little bigger than what you calculated. I don't know what it would cost to have the nylon chromed if possible. I had thought about cnc machining also. There are several options, not any of them will be low cost, unless I settle on black then paint in the yellow background. The chrome paint that really looks like chrome is about as expensive as chrome plating, at least on metal. I thought about trying to sandcast one out of pot metal, but not sure if it would come out right because of the thinness. It will be somewhat complicated and a lot of work involved. I will do more research and mostly a lot of thinking, but the 3d is probably the most practical and cost effective. I really want a frame like the original, but I don't want to spend a small fortune on one. lol

52 Ragtop
12-07-2017, 09:56 PM
StudeRich,
You mean the ones that Chuck Potter had years ago? I have one on my Avanti. Spent some $$$ getting it rechromed, and I painted it. It looks pretty good! I might have a few of them here somewhere!

Jim

Michidan
12-08-2017, 10:09 AM
Guys I work for 3D systems, the inventors of 3D printing in the 80s. But in the software area so I don't have any printers in my office. There are oodles of plastic printers now, something like 600 different companies making them worldwide.
I spent a few days with our metal printers this summer and they are WAY more impressive then they used to be. The finished parts are over 99% pure and dense, it's like they are billet. The surface finish isn't that great, but you can do all kinds of post process work to them. Nothing like the compressed metal dust of days past. There any many materials now too, although most are pretty exotic for healthcare applications. Titanium, etc but also varieties of stainless.

Most of us are not buying a $300K metal printer for the garage, but 3D systems has service bureau for making your parts - https://www.3dsystems.com/on-demand-manufacturing

Also, not cheap, of course. But if you really want a part, you can get one made no problem.

garyash
12-08-2017, 12:44 PM
Yes, Dan, the frame could be directly printed in stainless steel (infused with bronze). I've made some small parts this way and the results are very good.

However, the license plate frame, after I hollowed out the CAD file as much as I dared to occupy 70.3 cubic cm of material, will cost $48.12 in white nylon, $358 in 3D-printed stainless from Shapeways, about as cheap as it can get for 3D printed metal. I think I could take the plastic part to my local art foundry and have them make a wax replica from a silicone rubber mold and investment cast one part in aluminum or aluminum bronze for less than $358. Of course, If anyone needed more than one part, the investment cast copies get cheap in a hurry. Also, if you want to chrome plate the cast parts, that would be extra. A cast aluminum part might buff up nicely but would need to be kept polished to stay shiny. The stainless parts, if buffed well, would look pretty good, but not as bright as chrome or aluminum due to the bronze content. The frame could be CNC machined in aluminum, though the fine detail of the small letters would be challenging, like the inside corners of a K.

Ron Dame
12-09-2017, 08:44 AM
69026 This is what I want to make, I have had wanted ads on the internet for about a year now. No leads so far

That looks similar to my Pirotti Motors frame that I'l kike to reproduce.

garyash
12-22-2017, 04:32 PM
Cal wanted to have a license plate frame from the former Torvick Studebaker dealer in Santa Rosa, CA, so here is the result from Shapeways.com. It was made in "Black, strong, and flexible" nylon material. The details came out great and it's pretty smooth. A little light sanding before painting will help make it shine. Black matte plastic is really hard to photograph, but here are some pictures with a Mass. plate. Cal is going to work out the details of how to paint the background of the lettering.

69235692366923769238

wittsend
12-22-2017, 06:37 PM
For the record, in the US it is against the law in every state to cover the state name or any part of the license number with a frame or anything else that would interfere with it being read. However, states cannot prohibit covering over any slogan or other material (ie, "Garden State") that the state chooses to put on its license plates. That was the decision of the US Supreme Court in the late 1960s, after a person covered over the legend "World's Fair" on his 1964-65 New York license plates. The court ruled that the purpose of a license plate is vehicle identification, and both the state name and tag number were essential to fulfill that function. But vehicle owners could not be obligated to carry advertising for their state or industry.

The problem is that some states put their name on the top of the plate, and some on the bottom. So a single "universal" plate frame would have to have thin margins on both the top and bottom -- leaving not a lot of room for readable text.

Interesting. This is the "stock" location (factory drilled holes) of the front plate on my '73 Valiant. Not disputing the information, more scratching my head how they got away with it???

My some does 3D printing but typically declines anything I ask for. I've seen "blank" metal plates frames that are engraved with your word of choice.

garyash
12-22-2017, 09:51 PM
Remember, the original Torvick frame was for early '60s California "black plates" where the word CALIFORNIA at the top was located below the mounting holes. Later plates were different. Your mileage may vary, etc.

Skinnys Garage
12-22-2017, 11:28 PM
Interesting. This is the "stock" location (factory drilled holes) of the front plate on my '73 Valiant. Not disputing the information, more scratching my head how they got away with it???Your Valiant is missing a bracket that uses the two holes the plate is currently mounted to. Should also be a third hole under the bumper for the angled portion to attach. This bracket will have plate mounting holes that lower it for full view.

Mike Van Veghten
12-23-2017, 01:38 AM
Along with Gary's fine work..

These guys will make about anything you can conceive of. In various plastic's or other materials.
https://www.shapeways.com/

Mike

rbigcal
12-23-2017, 12:29 PM
Along with Gary's fine work..

These guys will make about anything you can conceive of. In various plastic's or other materials.
https://www.shapeways.com/

Mike


That's where Gary had it done.

rbigcal
01-22-2018, 06:31 PM
Ok guys after a crap load of sanding and paint this is what it looks like. I am going to later apply clear urethane over the whole thing, so it will be uv safe. Ran into several problems. For some reason the boxed in area with lettering on top had no top to the box. I had to glue a piece of abs door panel material there and recreate the missing area. I had it printed in black, so clear could be put on, plus be able to sand yellow off the top of the letters. It turned out that the black was just a thin coating over the white material. So after sanding the step lines and sort of textured surface down it revealed white areas. That caused me to have to paint it black and created a problem of cleaning off the yellow, I had to go back and touch up areas where black paint came off. The frame was a little undersized on backside, so plate didn't fit exactly right. I guess overall not too bad for sort of a prototype ! I am going to attempt to use this as a pattern to mold one out of die cast zinc material, then I can have it chromed. After a lot of research I found that you can use a conductive paint on the plastic, then it can be electroplated. I also got some quotes for the spray chrome that is available, $175.00. that's a bit more than I would spend. No matter how its done it is fairly expensive just for a license plate frame. But will be nice on the car.69927

Bullet
01-22-2018, 08:38 PM
That looks very nice. A lot of work, but as you said worth it in the end. I know I would love one of the dealership that my car came from.

Mark

rbigcal
04-27-2018, 06:45 PM
Update, I sandcasted 2 frames and chose the best to have chromed. Here are some pics of the sandcasting process and a picture of the chromed/painted version. I melted down old mirror frames and misc. chrome pot metal trim pieces to use for casting.

720307203172032720337203472035720367203772029

Ron Dame
04-27-2018, 06:50 PM
Wow, that's nice. I wish I could justify the price though.

rbigcal
04-27-2018, 07:07 PM
Wow, that's nice. I wish I could justify the price though.

I wonder if there are any high school shops that still do sandcasting and possibly even be able to cnc machine one or make a 3d printed one ? High school is where I learned to do sandcasting, but boy was that many moons ago.