Electrical: 6 Volt Flasher Question

[61LaRk4dr]

Can someone tell me what the correct 6 volt flasher unit I should have for a turn signal setup on a 1951 Studebaker Land Cruiser? I currently have four 6 volt units in my possession:

1 2507 (P229D) Made by Ideal NOS unit
2 P229D Original unit that came with the a wire harness that I salvaged pieces off of
3 535 Bronze colored Tung-Sol Flasher in my parts bin
4 535 heavy duty bought brand new from auto parts house

I posted several weeks back with problems blowing the 14 amp inline fuse. I have since taken care of that problem and now face the following issue:

- Both right and left rear turn signals work (flash) when lever on column is engaged
- No pilot lamps (arrows) in the speedometer housing
- No front turn signals from the parking lamps

The above only works when I use flasher unit 2 or 3. If I attempt to use the other two flasher units I will not get the following:

- Both right and left rear turn signals stay on solid (will not flash) when lever on column is engaged
- No pilot lamps (arrows) in the speedometer housing
- No front turn signals from the parking lamps

The fact that I am getting this reaction leads me to believe that I just have bad luck buying flasher units and can’t find one that works properly. I will not eliminate form the realm of possibilities that: “I just don’t know what the hell I am doing” but I would like to learn how to get through this. I have verified that the light bulbs to the pilot lights and to the parking lamps are good I have also verified that the flasher connector is connected correctly:

“X” = battery via ignition
“P” = Pilot lights in dash
“L” = Load (turn signal control)

[bert53]

The first thing I would check is the rear bulbs to see if you have filaments touching inside the bulb feeding power through the tail lamp wiring to the other side.

[StudeRich]

(1) Someone here was having Turn Signal problems on one of these Pre- 1955's that came WITHOUT the Optional Factory Turn Signals, and was retrofitted with an Aftermarket Kit, that is not your situation is it?

(2) I think what is going on here is you did not wire the dash Indicators to the Front Turn Signals.
I am not convinced that the Diagram you have:
“X” = battery via ignition
“P” = Pilot lights in dash
“L” = Load (turn signal control)

is correct for a Stude. how about: "P" = Front & Dash, X = Keyed Power, L = Rear to Turn Signal Switch to be switched between Stop and Turn?

(3) Just "Guessing" here, does that check out with testing?
I think a lot depends on your answer to question #1.

(4) Another thing to check is GROUNDS on the Dash Indicators AND the Front Turn Signals, do the Parking Lights WORK?

[61LaRk4dr]

(1) Someone here was having Turn Signal problems on one of these Pre- 1955's that came WITHOUT the Optional Factory Turn Signals, and was retrofitted with an Aftermarket Kit, that is not your situation is it?

(2) I think what is going on here is you did not wire the dash Indicators to the Front Turn Signals.
I am not convinced that the Diagram you have:
“X” = battery via ignition
“P” = Pilot lights in dash
“L” = Load (turn signal control)

is correct for a Stude. how about: "P" = Front & Dash, X = Keyed Power, L = Rear to Turn Signal Switch to be switched between Stop and Turn?

(3) Just "Guessing" here, does that check out with testing?
I think a lot depends on your answer to question #1.

(4) Another thing to check is GROUNDS on the Dash Indicators AND the Front Turn Signals, do the Parking Lights WORK?

Hi StudeRich,

Thank you for the information. "No" to your question (1). This car originally did not come with factory turn signals, but I did hunt down a factory switch from unclemiltie correct for 1951 and I had Lark Works make me an authentic reproduction harness based on what was originally connected to the car. I then followed the diagram here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hsf53059bcn254v/Signals%20%281%29.jpg?dl=0

I have a stupid question to ask: do the pilot light sockets, that get connected on the back of the speedometer, have to insulation between the metal on the back of the speedometer and the pilot light connector? I ask this because I completely remove the two strips of tape that were originally covering both pilot light holes and then clipped the special pilot light sockets into the holes.

To answer your question about the parking lights: yes they work when the light switch is pulled out to the parking light spot. The headlights, taillights, brake lights, parking lights, high beams, dash lights, courtesy lamps (front and back) trunk light for the license plate, and the light inside the truck all work.

[StudeRich]

Hmm, THAT is NO help, all I see is a Basic wire ROUTING Picture with NO Front Turn Signals, just Hd. Lts. & Tail Lts. that is NOT a wiring Diagram with correct Turn Signal terminal vs Wire number connections.

Try this:

https://www.studebakerparts.com/studebakerparts/store/s/html/images/52acc-wire.jpg

[Skip Lackie]

Not sure this will help much, but can confirm that flasher 535 is a HD 6v unit that will handle one to four 21 CP lamps. It is a universal replacement unit for a long list of obsolete 6v flashers. Flasher P229 is not listed in my catalog. It may be a good unit, but may need a load of four lamps to work properly. If you're not getting the front lamps to light, that might be why the rears are coming on and staying on -- that's a symptom of not enough load to trigger the flasher.

Your connections (X to battery and L to lamps) is correct. But P goes to the dash pilot light only if you have a single pilot light, as used on many aftermarket 6 volt systems (and the 59-60 Larks). P does not need to be connected to anything for the flasher to work. If you have two dash pilot lights, the wires to them have to come from the directional lamp switch itself, not the flasher. My guess is your system is not wired correctly -- the fact that your front lamps are not working is the clue.

[61LaRk4dr]

Not sure this will help much, but can confirm that flasher 535 is a HD 6v unit that will handle one to four 21 CP lamps. It is a universal replacement unit for a long list of obsolete 6v flashers. Flasher P229 is not listed in my catalog. It may be a good unit, but may need a load of four lamps to work properly. If you're not getting the front lamps to light, that might be why the rears are coming on and staying on -- that's a symptom of not enough load to trigger the flasher.

Your connections (X to battery and L to lamps) is correct. But P goes to the dash pilot light only if you have a single pilot light, as used on many aftermarket 6 volt systems (and the 59-60 Larks). P does not need to be connected to anything for the flasher to work. If you have two dash pilot lights, the wires to them have to come from the directional lamp switch itself, not the flasher. My guess is your system is not wired correctly -- the fact that your front lamps are not working is the clue.

Thank you for the information, as I said in the post I am not an expert at this. I could go to a shop, but I rather sink a little while so that I might learn a thing or two. One thing that I am confused by is there are two black wires one that comes out of each of the two special pilot light sockets that are install in the speedometer. Both of those black wires are spliced together and connected directly into the flasher plug titled "P". Also on the back of the special pilot light sockets are a terminal to accept a bullet connector. I have a wire going from each one of those that is connected in the wire harness that goes to the turn signal control on the steering column. The diagram in post 5 seems to confirm these connections. Are you saying that the two black wire that are splice together that go into the flasher plug from the pilot light sockets is not required? Not trying to sound flippant here, just don't understand.

[greyben]

You don't stat if this is the original turn signal setup assuming it is;

The fact that the rear signals are working and assuming the brake lights are also functioning says that power from the brake light switch and the flasher are correctly wired to the TS switch.

There should be separate wires coming from the turn signal multiconnector for each front signal. Make sure that wiring has continuity all the way from the connector to the front lamps. The wiring from the connector should go to a junction terminal in front of the radiator.

Verify the front lamps are inserted correctly. If they are reversed the parking filament will light rather than the flasher filament.

The shop manual should have a wiring diagram. I don't have one for '51, but in '55 the dash indicators are wired directly to the front signal wiring and in this case there wouldn't be a wire to the flasher for the indicators. This should be easily verified for your car in the shop manual.

There is always the possibility the signal switch is defective i.e. bad contacts or a broken wire.

[Deaf Mute]

When restoring my 1953 coupe, I went through at least four flashers before I found a good one. The guy at the NAPA counter was beginning to distrust my FLUKE meter. I had a drawing of the flasher with which contacts should make and break, the filament resistance and everything. I finally got a good one (they do not like returning electrical components even if you test them on their counter... but they did in this case). After I got a good one.. I ordered another for a spare ... that didn't work either. [We went as far as putting a tiny pencil mark on them to make sure we were not getting the same one back... we didn't.] GOOD LUCK!

[61LaRk4dr]

Hello Guys,

Thank you for all of your help. After reading the installation page with the parts contents of the kit I realized that the front parking lamp bulbs I was using were not the correct type. I was able to reference the number provided on the page and happened to have them on hand. Once I replaced the light bulbs, PRESTO! All is working now.

[Skip Lackie]

Good. Glad it got fixed.