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View Full Version : Who made the engines in Studebakers?



clarkwd
08-21-2017, 06:11 AM
At yesterdays local show they needed a trivia question to give away tickets to the NE Classic Car Museum. I told the announcer to ask who made the engine in my 53 Studebaker. It is a Passmaster 259 from a friends Speedster. They made the announcement and people flocked around my car checking out the engine and shouting out their answer. What a riot! They went through almost every car brand before someone got it right.
Bill

bjackameit
08-21-2017, 06:16 AM
http://billstudepage.homestead.com/files/engine.htm

tsenecal
08-21-2017, 09:42 AM
That was a great idea, and it generated some extra interest in our Studebaker brand. Car shows can get a little boring at times, so something like that would get people wound up.

dpson
08-21-2017, 09:46 AM
Well of course, it's the same engine Ford used in the Mustangs.

Avantidon
08-21-2017, 10:21 AM
I've gotten that question many times about the engine in my R-2 Avanti. Most tell me it is a Ford V-8. When I open the hood and show them I always ask was Ford's 289 that wide? The stutters start and then I tell them it is a Studebaker built engine and that Studebaker had a 289 while Ford was trying to make one out of their 260. Most just shake their heads, smile, say they learned something today and walk away. Others get angry, mumble and walk away. I guess that's the life of car shows today.

53k
08-21-2017, 10:28 AM
At yesterdays local show they needed a trivia question to give away tickets to the NE Classic Car Museum. I told the announcer to ask who made the engine in my 53 Studebaker. It is a Passmaster 259 from a friends Speedster. They made the announcement and people flocked around my car checking out the engine and shouting out their answer. What a riot! They went through almost every car brand before someone got it right.
Bill
When you get the old "it's a Ford 289" comment, tell them to look where the distributor is on a Ford 289 then look at where the distributor is on a Studebaker V-8.

Some years ago I saw an auction ad for an old salvage yard that was closing. The listing had a '53 Studebaker Commander Starliner with a Ford 289. I went just to see that car and straighten them out on engines. When I opened the hood, there sat a Ford 289.

jclary
08-21-2017, 11:45 AM
If you really want to puzzle the "self appointed know it all's" ...after setting them straight about the Studebaker 289...follow that up with..."YOU DO KNOW THAT STUDEBAKER HAD BEEN MANUFACTURING VEHICLES FOR A HALF CENTURY BEFORE FORD BECAME A CORPORATION ?!?!:D

Then watch the reactions, disbelief, bewilderment, vacant look, as they wander away from the crazy Studebaker guy.:yeahright::confused::whome:

As long as you use the word "vehicle," and not "automobile, or car," you are technically correct!;)

Gunslinger
08-21-2017, 01:02 PM
If you really want to puzzle the "self appointed know it all's" ...after setting them straight about the Studebaker 289...follow that up with..."YOU DO KNOW THAT STUDEBAKER HAD BEEN MANUFACTURING VEHICLES FOR A HALF CENTURY BEFORE FORD BECAME A CORPORATION ?!?!:D

Then watch the reactions, disbelief, bewilderment, vacant look, as they wander away from the crazy Studebaker guy.:yeahright::confused::whome:

As long as you use the word "vehicle," and not "automobile, or car," you are technically correct!;)

Actually...Studebaker had been making vehicles before Henry Ford was even born.

I remember once at a car show an old timer was adamant that Chevrolet made everyone's engines...they just changed the heads to make them look different. He said when he was younger he worked in a service station and saw that to be a fact.

Noxnabaker
08-21-2017, 02:39 PM
Such fun; once I met a guy who told me & a friend that Chevrolet made the first overhead V8 as my pal just said he's -53 Studebaker had a V8, so I said my -53 New Yorker wagon had a Hemi & did he know what that was...?
& that it came in -51, 2 years after Oldsmobile & Cadillac's V8's & that Studebaker introdused their V8 the same year as Chrysler...
He said we were full of ****!
I said "ok, so what year did Ford get their overhead V8? & Buick? & then even Plymouth?"
"After Chevy!" he said...
I would be really surprised if he STILL thinks that today thou...
:)

brngarage
08-21-2017, 02:49 PM
I don't remember whether it was 1914 or 1918, but Chevrolet had a V8 back then (and I THINK it had overhead valves)!

I just checked Jalopnik: First Chevy V8 made in 1918. It was 288 cubic inches, with overhead valves and crossflow heads. WOW!

Noxnabaker
08-21-2017, 02:54 PM
Surprised I stand!

Mike Van Veghten
08-21-2017, 06:16 PM
One MUST be careful...

Back in 1969 a high school friend bought a nice (black) Golden Hawk. The talk of the school. At that point in time, I didn't know that much about the Studebaker as a whole...BUT when he opened the hood, not only did it have the blower, it ALSO had the distributor in the "front" of the engine..!!
He said that the guy he bought it from had removed the blower engine from a T-Bird and put into the Stude.

So yea...not all may be as it seems...all the time.

Mike

Jett289
08-21-2017, 10:22 PM
I remember many years ago stopping at a car museum in Virden Manitoba and on display there is an early 1900's Chevrolet v8 engine car . It had a brief right up on it and said it was an original car .. I have driven by that museum many times since and will have to revisit again for sure .

HOXXOH
08-22-2017, 10:54 AM
When the Ford vs Studebaker question comes up, I usually mention that Studebaker celebrated their 100th anniversary the year before Ford celebrated their 50th. I follow it up with Lincoln rode to the Ford theater in a Studebaker carriage. That always gets them shaking their heads in disbelief.

Indyted
08-22-2017, 11:22 AM
I read on this forum a couple years back that an Avanti owner took his car to car show. There, he ran into some 'car experts' who where 100% adamant that the 289's in Avantis were the Ford 289. I really want to run into people like that so I can laugh in their faces.

Seriously, there is one sure way to silence all this Ford 289 talk. The Ford 289 was introduced in April 1963. By the end March 1963, 2,979 or 64% of all Studebaker Avantis were already built. How could almost 3,000 Avantis, be equipped with an Ford engine that had not been developed yet? Furthermore, why would Ford immediately sell its newly developed next generation engine to one of its competitors??

Studebaker Wheel
08-22-2017, 11:24 AM
When the Ford vs Studebaker question comes up, I usually mention that Studebaker celebrated their 100th anniversary the year before Ford celebrated their 50th. I follow it up with Lincoln rode to the Ford theater in a Studebaker carriage. That always gets them shaking their heads in disbelief.

Though the Studebaker Museum has the "Lincoln carriage" it was not built by them.

paintim613
08-22-2017, 11:35 AM
At local car show last Friday I think I was able to convince a spectator that no Avantis were ever made in Canada. Also, being able to say that both of my Studebakers have their original engines (232 and 289) always makes my day.

paintim613
08-22-2017, 11:40 AM
http://billstudepage.homestead.com/files/engine.htm
Nice to see your post, Bill. Some of us know of your expertise. Your featuring our '53 custom in October, 2011, was a prequel to being featured in January, 2017, issue of Hemmings Motor News.

Studebaker Wheel
08-22-2017, 11:46 AM
For what it is worth Studebaker built their first 289 c.i. engine in 1913 and it was in production until 1926. Hundreds of thousands were built and many still running.

drew72mgb
08-22-2017, 12:47 PM
I read on this forum a couple years back that an Avanti owner took his car to car show. There, he ran into some 'car experts' who where 100% adamant that the 289's in Avantis were the Ford 289. I really want to run into people like that so I can laugh in their faces.

Seriously, there is one sure way to silence all this Ford 289 talk. The Ford 289 was introduced in April 1963. By the end March 1963, 2,979 or 64% of all Studebaker Avantis were already built. How could almost 3,000 Avantis, be equipped with an Ford engine that had not been developed yet? Furthermore, why would Ford immediately sell its newly developed next generation engine to one of its competitors??

I have run into these spectators, and I don't even own a Studebaker -

But, I have tried to educate them -

To no avail - I have also gotten the story that Chevy bought the design rights to the "new" Studebaker truck - and introduced it as their "new" 1967 Chevrolet C-10 design. To that pile of BS I just shake my head, and walk away...

Noxnabaker
08-22-2017, 01:20 PM
#20, who could ever think they were look-a-likes...?
6641466415
;)

Milaca
08-22-2017, 10:12 PM
If you were to tally the various makes of engines powering the remaining Studebakers on the road, there are probably more GM powered Studebakers than anything else. I prefer to stick with Studebaker power, it makes my Studebakers even more unique! ;)

HOXXOH
08-22-2017, 10:44 PM
Though the Studebaker Museum has the "Lincoln carriage" it was not built by them.
Oops, that's what I get for assuming. I just researched that and found it to be made by the Wood Brothers of NY. Thanks for the correction.

Chrycoman
08-25-2017, 02:31 AM
If you really want to puzzle the "self appointed know it all's" ...after setting them straight about the Studebaker 289...follow that up with..."YOU DO KNOW THAT STUDEBAKER HAD BEEN MANUFACTURING VEHICLES FOR A HALF CENTURY BEFORE FORD BECAME A CORPORATION ?!?!:D

Then watch the reactions, disbelief, bewilderment, vacant look, as they wander away from the crazy Studebaker guy.:yeahright::confused::whome:

As long as you use the word "vehicle," and not "automobile, or car," you are technically correct!;)

The Ford Motor Company was always a "corporation". The firm was founded in 1903, issued stock (the Dodge brothers held 10%), had a president and various officers. The difference, though, is that the original Ford Motor Company was organized as a private corporation - it could issue stock, but could not trade it on the stock market and there were restrictions on how a private corporation could sell its stock or look for buyers. In most states and provinces there was a maximum number of stockholders a private corporation could have.

The Dodge brothers 10% was worth $10,000 in 1903. In the summer of 1919 Henry Ford decided to buy out all the non-Ford family stockholders. The Dodge brothers shares were now worth $12,500 each and the brothers received $25 million for their 10%.

In 1956 the Ford Motor Company was reorganized and became a public corporation - it could now trade its stock on the market and there were no restrictions as to the number of stockholders it had.

Jett289
08-25-2017, 12:22 PM
For what it is worth Studebaker built their first 289 c.i. engine in 1913 and it was in production until 1926. Hundreds of thousands were built and many still running.

Very interesting Richard .. Were these 6 cylinder engines ? That many were built ? Hundreds of thousands ?
What are the particulars on this engine ?

studegary
08-25-2017, 12:29 PM
The Ford Motor Company was always a "corporation". The firm was founded in 1903, issued stock (the Dodge brothers held 10%), had a president and various officers. The difference, though, is that the original Ford Motor Company was organized as a private corporation - it could issue stock, but could not trade it on the stock market and there were restrictions on how a private corporation could sell its stock or look for buyers. In most states and provinces there was a maximum number of stockholders a private corporation could have.

The Dodge brothers 10% was worth $10,000 in 1903. In the summer of 1919 Henry Ford decided to buy out all the non-Ford family stockholders. The Dodge brothers shares were now worth $12,500 each and the brothers received $25 million for their 10%.

In 1956 the Ford Motor Company was reorganized and became a public corporation - it could now trade its stock on the market and there were no restrictions as to the number of stockholders it had.

Interesting information, but Studebaker still made vehicles more than half a Century (50 years) before that 1903 Ford date.

8E45E
08-25-2017, 01:10 PM
I remember many years ago stopping at a car museum in Virden Manitoba and on display there is an early 1900's Chevrolet v8 engine car . It had a brief right up on it and said it was an original car .. I have driven by that museum many times since and will have to revisit again for sure .

The first Chevrolet V8 was 1917. I posted pictures of a 1918 here: http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?31815-1918-Chev-V8

Craig

Jett289
08-25-2017, 01:29 PM
Thanks craig some fantastic pics there .

WayneXG95
08-27-2017, 07:52 PM
What? "The Dodge brothers shares were now worth $12,500 each and the brothers received $25 million for their 10%." In 1919 - I need to sit down for a while and take that in.

HOXXOH
08-28-2017, 01:53 PM
What? "The Dodge brothers shares were now worth $12,500 each and the brothers received $25 million for their 10%." In 1919 - I need to sit down for a while and take that in.

Google Dodge vs Ford 1919. Henry had a ton of cash and wanted total control. The method he used forced other investors to sell or lose it.

S2Deluxe
08-28-2017, 03:46 PM
The first Chevrolet V8 was 1917. I posted pictures of a 1918 here: http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?31815-1918-Chev-V8

Craig

I've seen this car, at local car shows, a couple of times. It's quite a rare and fascinating vehicle! In spite of its advanced cylinder head design, the oiling system only provides pressurised lubrication to the camshaft and main bearing journals. The valve lubrication requires frequent removal of the valve covers and soaking of fibrous absorbent pads that ride on top of the rockers, with oil.

Mark

orecrush
08-28-2017, 05:57 PM
Dodge Brothers made almost all the running gear for Ford up to 1914