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View Full Version : Brakes: Wheel Cylinders (new but 6 years sitting in basement); Discoloration (corrosion) started; replace?



bsrosell
07-15-2017, 10:48 AM
Not sure if I'm being too anal here, or avoiding leaking on Day 1; restoring ground-up '57 GHawk, and bought a BUNCH of stuff at the 2011 Springfield Intl. meet , to avoid shipping; all things I knew I'd need eventually and there it all was; had a van full.. I've had this (IN my house, but original packaging). But, had the brake wheel cylinders, and NEVER THOUGHT to put them in sealed bags; so sitting since 2011. Project has just has gone slower than I planned for various reasons and just getting to putting the rear end back together and first set of brakes (Hurray!). Crappy job without spring spreader, and ended up tearing a boot.. oh well. BUT, when rubber boot broke, plunger popped out, and was disturbed to see a "discoloration" area of orangish color inside cylinder. , just like a little 'puddle' appearance, but no texture; Still FEELS smooth, and have not taken the other ones apart yet.

1) Can I just gently 'wipe away' where it has discolored, or at least 'smooth' whatever is there even though I can't feel anything with my fingers? with Scotchbrite? Simichrome polish? Yes, I'm paranoid about brake cylinders, and plan to use silicone DOT5, so NOT wanting any leaks, so don't want to wear on micro-corrosion "stain", OR screw up the cylinder by trying to polish with anything.

2) if rule of thumb here is "if discolored, it has started rusting, BUY NEW ONES", does anyone have a good brand and the part numbers for a Golden Hawk (front and rear are different size bore), that I could get at CARQUEST or NAPA this morning? Have all day to work on it for once...

3) what do you use as lubricant on the master cylinders, Vaseline? Shop Manual says NO LUBRICANT, because of the rubber ..... But there was obviously some protecting stuff on this (FEELS like Vaseline, but have no idea). And obviously was not put on everywhere; the non-slippery areas are where it is slightly orange/discolored. Want SOMETHING at least on those pins where they go through holes in the rubber caps, but not sure what to use; modern rubbers withstand a lot more than in 1957.



Thanks guys!
Barry

unclemiltie
07-15-2017, 10:54 AM
I always clean up NOS ones with rubbing alcohol and wire wheel the outside if they have surface rust and sometimes paint the outside If the inside has any rust I do not use them

0000 steel wool is good for cleaning the inside with the alcohol but they have to be cleaned very very good with no steel pieces left. I always then lubricate the inside with dot 5 brake fluid. If any rubbers are not as they should be I replace them. I only use silicone in my cars as I do not drive them as often as I should and I do not want a wheel cyl freezing up over the winter

bsrosell
07-15-2017, 11:30 AM
FOUND the interchange list on the Tech Tips page (great resource! had forgotten about that). Several interchange numbers for the cylinders...

bsrosell
07-15-2017, 12:46 PM
Here are photos per my post last night; one each of the rear set. 6561265613: what say thee?? Gently polish with 0000 steel wool and alcohol, and apply DOT 5 (and buy one rebuild kit for the torn rear boot)?
Or, bite the bullet, learn a lesson, and buy new cylinders?

the Front cylinders appear 'clean' (all of it got lubed before shipping??), but 'ring' of debris in there; would at least have to treat them like a 'rebuild' and disassemble and clean it all up. Rust (surface, mild) on the back side of all four that will clean up easily with wire brush, but made me suspicious and look inside (besides the torn boot forcing it when the plunger flew out on the floor :-).

Thoughts? At this point in the day, going to have to order anyway, CARQUEST didn't even have access to any of the interchange numbers, so will call one of our vendors for the rubber boot I tore, at the very least, if not both rear cylinders.

StudeRich
07-15-2017, 01:03 PM
The CORRECT way to recondition a USED Wheel Cylinder should work even BETTER on a shelf damaged New Cylinder.

Just buy a wheel Cylinder hone at your Parts Store and Hone them out lightly with alcohol or brake fluid liberally on the stones and walls of cylinders keeping them Wet. Thoroughly Clean them afterwords and install new Rubber Kits.

bsrosell
07-15-2017, 01:14 PM
thanks Rich; that seems like a good option.
Pardon my ignorance (used to disc brakes, or Model-A mechanical :-), but I take it the INNER RUBBER plunger is the key element for "no leaks", therefore the metal plunger(?) to push the pin is NOT critical as long as it is smooth?

I dropped one, so if so, I will polish it up a little more than I did previously to POSITIVELY make sure no 'nick' is raised and can scratch the bore.


The CORRECT way to recondition a USED Wheel Cylinder should work even BETTER on a shelf damaged New Cylinder.

Just buy a wheel Cylinder hone at your Parts Store and Hone them out lightly with alcohol or brake fluid liberally on the stones and walls of cylinders keeping them Wet. Thoroughly Clean them afterwords and install new Rubber Kits.

StudeRich
07-15-2017, 02:05 PM
Yes, if you can find the Inner Cups 1 1/16" Front and 7/8" Rear separately, that is all you need, but it's only a few dollars more for all 4 Seals per Cylinder with Springs in the "Kits" for all new fresh parts.

The Pistons should be fine if you did not dent that one, just clean them.

bsrosell
07-16-2017, 10:08 AM
Thanks Rich; got in touch with Phil, sending a new 'rebuild kit' for my torn one; I'll pick up a hone and spring tool (pliers or lever, have not decided yet. Maybe both for <$10 each :-) I'd say it cost me a whole Saturday NOT having one (by ripping my seal), BUT, I never would have seen the corrosion and taken care of that on both the rears (photos above). Even thought fronts look 'lubed' and clean yet, after 6 years will lightly run through all four; hard to see plus there IS a ridge of 'build up' of some type of crumbly crud; hardened lube?. SO, a lucky mistake on my part that will save me grief later on. Thanks to all for the good tips and input! As usual!!

OH, almost forgot to ask; MIGHT be instructions with the cylinder hone (who knows these days), but do you hone using brake fluid, alcohol, OIL? (going to clean everything with alcohol afterwards anyway). Oil always seems the best lubricant for any metal machining, which honing is a very very mild version of..... What is best-practice here?

StudeRich
07-16-2017, 12:30 PM
Read Post #5, NEVER use any Petroleum Product (Oil) anywhere in a Hydraulic System, it will damage the rubber Parts!

altair
07-17-2017, 03:37 AM
As an experiment here in the Pacific North West/South Western British Columbia where corrosion and rust are inherent problems I experimented with vacuum sealing some brake parts. With five years behind the experiment there is no further rust or corrosion on the parts.65689

bsrosell
07-17-2017, 10:11 AM
Read Post #5, NEVER use any Petroleum Product (Oil) anywhere in a Hydraulic System, it will damage the rubber Parts!

"Hone them out lightly with alcohol or brake fluid liberally on the stones and walls of cylinders keeping them Wet"
Sorry Rich; too many meds, my memory is flaky these days! :-) (literally). Thanks again for the good advice. And I'll try to remember read back through the posts before re-asking for information already there.

Altair; good experiment! vacuum sealing makes sense; too bad you can't (cheaply?) vacuum seal a car while in storage :-) (though I've read where rich dudes have done so, bought brand new cars to put away for years as an investment....)